Wanted 420 Crawler

[deereboy89]

Hey guys im looking for a 420 crawler. Im looking for something in decent shape im not afraid of turning a wrench but it would be nice if i didnt HAVE to go into the clutches. 4 or 5 roller either way works, id like something with a direction reverser. What id like to use it for is back filling around a basement. Maybe fix a creek crossing and push a little snow. Im in Iowa but im not afraid to drive to get somethng. Anyone have any leads i can chase??
Thanks

[JD440ICD2006]

If you have bought old tractors, you are part of the way there.
The biggest thing on an old crawler such as a 420C is the final drive and undercarriage. There are not so many people out there that really know the ins and outs of the U/C.
The evidence is that many sellers describe a U/C as "about 60%". You can bet that is nothing more than a number they dreamed up to help sell the machine. You can even find crawlers with pretty deep grousers but the U/C is past worn out. It looks good to the untrained eye.
The U/C and steering cluthes are where you will spend time and money if they are worn out. In many cases, if someone has replaced them, they either are not selling that crawler or you could not afford what they wanted to get their money out of it. Besides, there should always be receipts for any work that is claimed.
Please do not take any of this as negative and lose your desire to get an old cralwer. I am just asking you to take your time and/or have someone (other than the seller in most cases) that really knows what to look for.
As for a 420C specifically, try to get later model as they are basically a 430 with different sheet metal.
Good luck and keep us posted.

[deereboy89]

I was figuring a later 420 would be better my reason for the 420 in particular is I have a 420w I did a ground up restoration of and a 420tlp waiting for one... it would fit the collection nicely. A late 420 will have the same reverser as a 430? How much difference does the shoe type make? I've seen some with rubber street shoes versus grousers? Obviously less traction but how much?
Thanks again

[JD440ICD2006]

Most if not all of the upgrades and mechnical changes can be found on the very late 1958 420 models. To my knowledge, there is no serial number registry that would tell which model had which upgrade as they were changed as older parts were depleted in Dubuque.
On Dubuque wheeled tractors, the "mark in the sand" for most of the last changes to the two cylinder models is when the slant steering came out.
You just have to pour over the crawler that you find for sale and know what to look for.
I owned a late 420W that had the later block (T10474T) but still had the small dip stick on the left side. The block was cast with the area for the larger dip stick and oil filler on the right side but it had not been punched out. This is the same block that went in the 1958 440IC.
Never buy a crawler like this at an auction UNLESS you know the seller and crawler real well and have driven it. You need at least 20-30 minutes for everything to warm up. Auctions do not allow that for sake of time and for sake of something rearing it's ugly head thus lowering the bidding prices.

You mentioned that you are going to push dirt. You need grousers with cleat left on them. Rubber pads are fine for show tractors but will not push much dirt. Same with semi grouser tracks that were designed for crawlers with loaders. I have seen these on crawlers with dozer blades. You just cannot get the traction with those.

[deereboy89]

So if a guy finds a nice tractor but the big problem is that it doesnt have grousers how much work-expense is there to switch them from street shoes to grousers?

[Lavoy]

Take out some bolts, and change to the style you want.
Lavoy

[jtrichard]

or get grouser stock and weld it on... i did that on my 2010 dozer it had street pads

[deereboy89]

So i may have found a pretty sharp looking late 420 which is located in illinois. Its a late model with a mechanical 6 way adjustable blade, and direction reverser. Its a 4 roller, id rather have a five roller with that heavy 62 blade up there but ill look at it anyways. The owner had the track rebuilt 20 years ago when he restored it and hasnt done much with the tractor since then my concern is if the track was bad enough to be rebuilt he probably should of done the idlers or rollers. He says the tracks dont run off and everythings solid but i was wondering if you guys had some big pointers for me when i go to look at it in person?

[JD440ICD2006]

The best thing to do is take someone with you that you trust that knows these little crawlers. Even if you have to pay them, it could save you many times over.
You cannot get the kind of knowledge and tips out of any book or this site, not in a short amount of time anyway.
There are just too many things that can potentially bite you where it hurts. Sometimes sellers know it, other times they are innocent due to their own lack of deep knowledge.

One example is, how many times have I seen a seller honestly list a crawler as "original", only to find that a number of key parts have been replaced with aftermarket and/or welded and repaired? That in itself will kill the top value of an antique crawler.